S2Ep6: “Managing athlete, business and family life" with Dave Harvey

An athlete comes in many forms. True to its name an athlete has the ability to pick up different sports and have a natural talent in transition to them. So says true of Dave, an ex professional rugby player that hung up the boots in search of his own journey in business. Now, an F45 owner, Dave shares with us his experiences in sport, and his life as a husband, dad and business owner.

@daveharvey17

Transcript

Jac Simmonds  0:00  
Welcome back. Here we are balanced experience podcast Jaco.

Nick Papastamatis  1:50  
How's it going?

Jac Simmonds  1:51  
I'm doing pretty good. Nicko, how are you on this fine Thursday?

Nick Papastamatis  1:55  
Mate, I am. Fantastic. I'm looking forward to this wonderful guests that we have on today. He's someone that I'm in awe of because he's been able to transition from sport to sport to sport to sport, as well as be able to establish a successful business, if not more than one, and continue on his endeavors. And one of the things as well as be a wonderful father and husband. And it's something that that I find is really a someone that is a, I suppose a living, breathing version of that theoretical, what does it mean to be healthy, and having and finding that balance in your life? And I don't know if that's the reality behind what it looks like. But Dave is a great example. And he leads that life and it's any someone that I think everyone can learn from. So Dave, Welcome. Welcome. 

Dave Harvey  2:53  
Thanks, boys. Thanks for having me. It's very humbled. Thank you. No kleenex around here, I see chocolates and fruit, but no tissues.

Jac Simmonds  3:02  
Yep. No, that's always nice, isn't it? It's good. You need that at the start of your day every day. Butter you up a bit.

Dave Harvey  3:08  
can you can you call me can you call me up each morning?

Jac Simmonds  3:10  
Yeah. Well,

Dave Harvey  3:11  
good morning, Dave.

Jac Simmonds  3:12  
Mate you got this recording now. So make it your alarm, you know? 

Nick Papastamatis  3:18  
You just need my voice like a one minute snip of either.

Dave Harvey  3:21  
I just keeps snozzing so I just keep hearing it.

Nick Papastamatis  3:22  
Yeah. Welcome, Dave to Dave. You are. Okay. So Dave, maybe you want to give us a little rundown. Do you agree with all that? Like, is that is that pretty much how you've tried to live your life?

Dave Harvey  3:36  
Oh, my they're lovely words. To certain extent, I'd probably say yes. is probably a little peak period in my mid 20s. Where I went a little bit awol, that professional rugby kind of really reeled me in on a Wednesday night or Friday night and Sunday afternoon. But yeah, pretty much like how it rolls at the moment in terms of business and training and lifestyle and family families always first and you got the family in place, and then everything can kind of, you know, have a little domino effect. So that's kind of how we live it as a family in terms of like a whole whole healthy lifestyle. healthy, healthy home.

Jac Simmonds  4:13  
That's good. So I guess where's the Dave Harvey story begin. Oh, when did we start? I mean, we we sort of did a little recap before and obviously like a big part of your your story is your is your sport, right? So where where does sport fit in in your life? And where did it begin initially?

Dave Harvey  4:33  
Probably from the day I was born. I think there's a there's a video of me holding a cricket bat when I was only one or two and and dads throwing a tennis ball and I'm planning on building about 20 minutes over his head. Yes, I'm pretty young. I was born into a pretty good sporting pedigree family. Grandfather played 79 test for Australia is invincible probably. He's the only one live in the moment out of those lot. Thats of the immortals yeah yeah 1948 yeah cousin played for St. Kilda... one three brand lows two brand lows. Robert Harvey. Oh, well, that's Yes, that's grandpa's nephew.

Nick Papastamatis  5:15  
You liked Robert Harvey Jac?

Jac Simmonds  5:18  
Robert Harvey no relation to Bret Harvey is it?

Dave Harvey  5:22  
I think Melbourne is littered with Harveys Yeah,

I think I'm the only one in Castle Hill there So yeah, I was I was born into a family with a few others you know a South African cousin that played for RSA rugby and yeah, I think from the get go was probably my I guess story and was really written on the water to do something and rugby u8s threat started.

Jac Simmonds  5:46  
Nice rugby union from the beginning.

Dave Harvey  5:48  
It was Yeah, started at rugby. I actually wanted to play mum wanted me to play football, soccer. But apparently I want to tackle people which so anyone anyone listening that knows me, which is quite bizarre, because I actually didn't do a lot of tackling. It's a good little good little U turn.

Jac Simmonds  6:05  
So it sounds like you're coming from a family with you know, enormous athletic pedigree. So, you know, essentially born into it. When did you start seeing some success? 

Dave Harvey  6:14  
Um, funny. I'll probably cricket to be honest early on. Dad, my dad and my uncle grew up playing a lot of a lot of kind of rep and first grade together you up to be the creaky 70

Nick Papastamatis  6:27  
Yeah, and us but definitely nothing good. Yes. Careful how good I make myself

Dave Harvey  6:36  
Yes, I've fair bit pressure on them being like, you know, for Neil Harvey being their father, which is understandable. So that kind of like took their interest away from playing at a high level. So I started playing cricket as a junior and stsarted hitting the ball well, and, and I guess it was, you know, from under 10s all the way to like 16 I think probably under 16s, I started to realize I could play the game pretty well. And he's called greenshield at the time. Oh, yeah. So we won greenshield Parramatta won it at the time we he had phenomenal time. And then went on to play a little bit of cricket then and then I go to a kind of fork in the road where had to choose between. Choose between footy and cricket? I think at the start actually when I was playing rugby. I was known for rugby at school, but I didn't even make it rep team rugby at all. I made like a club rep team. But maybe I didn't even make the they like Sydney Western CHF and stuff like that at score. I'd never met the zone team, which is like out of five schools in the area. Alright. It's pretty funny, huh?

Nick Papastamatis  7:32  
It's funny how it's funny. How were these ends up as well. You know, I actually went to school. What's his name? His name is Michael Hooper. I'm not sure if you know the captain of the Wallabies. Yes.

Dave Harvey  7:43  
I've played against him a couple of times.

Jac Simmonds  7:44  
I see him at the dog park all the time.

Nick Papastamatis  7:47  
All right. Well, he went to Pius he went to my school. Yeah, he was probably three or four years under me. It's funny because he was in the first 15. From literally, I'd say I'm gonna say year eight. And then obviously, took Pius into a different stratosphere when it came to playing rugby. So it's just funny how some some people's careers start like that. Now, I'd say Hooper is a bit of an anomaly. I don't think comparing anyone to Hooper is you know, but then at the same time, it's kind of like some people just either they late bloom or they just have they just don't really care that much at the beginning. Yeah. Did you feel like you should have been selected?

Dave Harvey  8:29  
I did go to a performing arts school so that might have something to do. I went to North Meade my sister was at the time. Okay, No, I didn't. I didn't dance was...

Jac Simmonds  8:43  
We lost all that story... ballet.

Dave Harvey  8:46  
Well, that flexibility is gone. No, care actually, that was a funny thing. So DK from young age I played is up. It's a public school system. So they didn't really have a good pathway in a sport. And then I played opens a quarter the time says juniors opens I played opens for me seven. So I played knockout comps and other comps. And yeah, I probably cared too much at the time. It's probably way my personality is at the moment, in probably caring a lot first stuff, probably some stuff that I shouldn't be caring about. But yes, I do care a fair bit. care a lot about the both. And as I said, l  ended up getting to a fork in the road where I kind of had to choose and, and I had to, you know, figure out which one I would like to try to make a living out of.

Jac Simmonds  9:33  
what was it about rugby union then as opposed to cricket?

Dave Harvey  9:36  
Oh, no. Like my stepdad at the time. who've, you know, we spoke about a bit of a twat... shout out. He mate he was

Jac Simmonds  9:45  
I hope he was listening. Yeah.

Dave Harvey  9:48  
It'd be good. Yeah, we'll get to him somehow. Now he was he had a rugby back. He had a rugby background, played on he played in a sort of bit of third grade. So he loved the sport and we were living in Cammeray at the time. So that was Like possibly. Yeah, so that was like, North Sydney, Mosman that was definitely not rugby league territory, and it's union. Yeah. So we got into union then and then play it up until like, I think under funny enough the same year we went greenshield for Parramatta, we won the under 16. State cup for Parramatta for rugby. All right

Nick Papastamatis  10:22  
you really like so you played Parramatta no you were in Parramatta, I played for Parramatta with greenshield. Yeah, yeah, right. Yeah, you're playing like, look at as a as a through the 15/16 year old sort of, sort of adolescent cricket greenshield is kind of like the Sydney Pinnacle. Okay. And, or, like a lot of kids strive to make greenshield sides. And then obviously, the was the other cup. Sorry,

Dave Harvey  10:50  
that was a state cup or something. Yes, it is the Sydney club rugby teams that play now. Yeah. Is this their junior program says goes from under 10-16 to high level.

Jac Simmonds  10:59  
Yeah. Okay. So we have this chat before like about actually like rugby league and rugby union and in New South Wales. In Australia, there's the the private school stigma with rugby union. How did you go from obviously being, you know, involved in the public school system to it? Was there that stigma there? Is that is that in? Is that true? Or is that is that?

Dave Harvey  11:19  
True? What color's the table? It's white. Very ture

Jac Simmonds  11:21  
Yeah. Yeah, it's

Dave Harvey  11:25  
my Yeah, it's it was very rife. Weren't what used to be talking about? Very, very rife from early 2000s. Probably To be honest, to only about three or four years ago,

Nick Papastamatis  11:38  
right. Yeah. As in, you'd be shunned if you weren't,

Dave Harvey  11:41  
yeah, yeah. So I can only put a hand I can only think of a handful of non and I'm sure there's more. But I can only think of that in in the years that I grew up. So I think I finished school in 99 and then played a little bit of colts rugby and so when I went into first grade, I think it was 2003 I was 17/18. So it would have been 2002 maybe there was only one player that was not a private school player. That was to Tatafu Polotanau now he went on to play 110 times to Australia. And he was the only non private school rugby player I think within the Wallabies at a time or in this so I could be wrong. But um, yeah, it is extremely rough. It's a prime example of skipping ahead a few years 2011 I won what was called the ken Catchpole medal, which is like the Daly M of rugby, right. So I was lucky enough to win that twice and finished. finished third, four times. But in 2011, the year I won it. And then the Rookie of the year got the Super Rugby contract for three years, then I didn't get anything at that time. So no, like there's no bitter feelings at all. Everyone knows me. I'm just like, yeah, whatever it happens, but that was kind of like, okay, the private school system is still Yeah,

Jac Simmonds  12:56  
so pretty strong made it harder for you coming through, I guess that you weren't ...

Dave Harvey  12:59  
I think I blamed my dad because I was enrolled in Shore. But um, he didn't want to pay the bills. Shout out to Dad. he's a he's an ex Shore boy. So I blame him for my lack of early entry into elite rugby. Yeah.

Nick Papastamatis  13:12  
I'll tell you what, I don't know. Like, I've literally only just been discussing kids with my wife recently. And the thought of the private school fees oh mate. 

Jac Simmonds  13:24  
Oh, well, my wife works and my wife works for Barker college, which and she went to Barker college. I mean, 30 grand a year. That's pretty nice. Not a joke and good schools. Oh, yeah. 100% but I mean it that's a massive expense.

Dave Harvey  13:38  
Yeah, I did. I did some teaching. When I graduated from uni. I did some teaching at Kings. And did you see Yeah, I taught there for probably about six eight months and a full time job came up and I decided to travel Europe and that's how I end up playing footy in Europe. So it's not a bad idea. But um, it's I can see where the fees go you know, state of the art gym and all that, you know, they're feeding every teacher and every kid breakfast lunch and dinner and

Nick Papastamatis  14:00  
No, doubt, it's going somewhere.

Jac Simmonds  14:02  
Yeah, of course.

Nick Papastamatis  14:04  
It's still a lot of money.

Jac Simmonds  14:05  
Yes. Yeah. And it's interesting if that culture is still around in the rugby union world or if it's starting to fade.

Dave Harvey  14:12  
from what I've seen of light I think a lot of people are getting getting a well deserved go through I think results in ability.

Jac Simmonds  14:19  
I think one player at the moment, who stands out who maybe maybe breaks that mold a little bit too is Quade Cooper someone who had not a private school upbringing and maybe a little bit rough around the edges as well. Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Nick Papastamatis  14:34  
Did he have it didn't have to go in the league rugby league league for a bit. Yes. 

Dave Harvey  14:39  
There was chats about I think he did very well. A lot of raw talent.

Jac Simmonds  14:43  
Yeah, definitely. So I mean, with rugby union, and in terms of like breaking into professional rugby union, how old were you?

Dave Harvey  14:50  
Mate I was old. I probably do things a little bit backwards. Actually. A lot of people play that career here in Australia. Then they go to Europe. I went to Europe pretty young. I think it would have been 21/22 and one of the players at Parramatta have played for Tom at the World Cup. He's like I've got a contact in Europe Do you want to go so yeah, so it'll go went over for three and a half months pretty low division at the best time of my life was fantastic. didn't drink before I got there and then borderline alcoholic when I got back. Yeah, we won a cup final Twickenham played really well. So I ended up doing about four, three to four seasons back to back in England. So that was my first probably foray into professional rugby, and UK so it would have been pretty young but 21/22/23 or two, and then came back and thought you know, it's time to settle in Australia and try and do some more here. And so steady for about four or five years paid Australian sevens, which is pretty cool. Got to travel the world a little bit and well tell you what sevens is. That's a brutal that would be up play six to seven games on a weekend. I'd rather play 2x 80 minute games back to back. It's tough. 

Nick Papastamatis  16:02  
How long would the rugby seven games?

Dave Harvey  16:04  
Seven minute halves. So 14 minutes. And you

Nick Papastamatis  16:07  
that's what you'd be able to tolerate?

Dave Harvey  16:08  
You can't do any more even 7.

Nick Papastamatis  16:10  
Yeah, say it's how far How far are you running in seven minutes? Oh,

Dave Harvey  16:15  
I couldn't tell you. We didn't use GPS is when I was playing for Australia. But when I play for Brazil, we did but I couldn't understand what they were saying. So you do a lot you do a lot and it's all top end. So you're looking at 85 90% your heart rate for 7 minutes. That's brutal with a minute or two break takes us yeah, and the contact the contacts much more brutal because it's one on one you have to hit you have to hit hard. Yeah, if you miss you know and then

Nick Papastamatis  16:41  
and then you've got to be skillful at the same time. Yeah, yep, that's elite.

Dave Harvey  16:46  
Anyway, so then from there then I'm I was lucky enough to play I guess. play Super Rugby when I was 29. So you'd say Late Bloomer, maybe? Or just yeah, just got lucky. I guess I was in France at the time playing playing professional rugby in France and the guy the guy from Western force actually got sacked because he was stealing money out of his teammates lockers.

Jac Simmonds  17:11  
What No,

Nick Papastamatis  17:13  
you're joking.

Dave Harvey  17:14  
So look, and that's how I got my opportunity. So

Jac Simmonds  17:18  
yeah, how did you find so the life of a traveling or not being in your home country? How did you find that sort of life? You know, being a professional athlete and living away from home?

Dave Harvey  17:29  
A good question because I think a lot of people think it's all diamonds and roses and the first two to three months are phenomenal. You fly over there you got your suitcase you got whatever you need you like new country new surroundings.

Nick Papastamatis  17:42  
You think you're a mad dog?

Dave Harvey  17:43  
Yeah, yeah, you're the bee's knee's you get put up in the house you go pick up your car you're like this is your car like I paid in the UK sponsored by Peurgeot as I say this I lived in the center of Milan for a year in Italy and that sounds so yeah, it's pretty cool. But like after three months, you're like Alright, this is not what we're used to. This is not a lifestyle language barrier. You kind of cling on to a few mates and some of my best mates I actually met overseas it was the rugby was good. Traveling Europe is sensational because you're an hour and a half two hours away from most paces, lifestyle amazing but it's not home for me it wasn't home. I loved it but it wasn't it after it was almost like grind from month 4 like month eight but the first four months are great and that that probably showed you I guess in a lot of foreigners performances they are they love it and excel well they start off really well and then they kind of like plateau.

Nick Papastamatis  18:18  
It's different. It's not even how it's one of it how good you are at the game. It's how good you can deal with life as an athlete. Like everything that's involved as an athlete like you know, it can it can turn you into a like I can understand after dealing with many athletes in mockery. Why athletes sometimes sometimes come across, like, like tickets. Oh, yeah, yeah, because like all people they get treated like an object.

Dave Harvey  19:06  
Yeah, yep, there's no say. I guess in a professional sporting world there's no your job's not safe. So I'll go back to Super ob for a minute so I went into super rugby set up was pretty cool because I made my debut in Sydney so paying for Perth there funny enough I went over play a trial and match for him. The kick the game before I think round two of the Super rugby season played really well got on a plane the next morning flew back to Sydney because I didn't hear anything because I was like sweet I'll go home now. I don't just mean back from France for seven days. Oh, well. flew back to Sydney on on the way back to Sydney. I got a voicemail from the coach. Yeah, mate. Where are you? We need you in Perth got back on a plane on the Monday morning then moved to Perth and then he's like sweet you're gonna you're gonna start you're gonna start at fullback am I playing in Sydney so went back to Sydney on Wednesday. Holy moly three return trips in three days. So go to my my friends. Yeah, France. Oh France to Sydney, Sydney to Perth. Perth to Sydney, Sydney to Perth, Perth to Sydney, Sydney and Melbourne, Melbourne and Perth and how secure in your career are you feeling now? 

Jac Simmonds  20:06  
That's great. Yeah,

Nick Papastamatis  20:08  
Spent more time in the air thasn on the field.

Dave Harvey  20:12  
Played my debut in front of my family in front of my friends is pretty cool. That's cool. They didn't have to fly anywhere. But mate the professional set up. It's It's crazy. It's not what it's great because it's doing what you love. But it's not exactly what most people think it is your video analysis is it's cutthroat you play one bad game you might not be in the team the next week. Yeah, and if your replacement say you know if you're my replacement you you play well and I'm like crap. I'm just gonna watch you kick goals all day.

Nick Papastamatis  20:40  
We have spoken about this on another podcast, but you develop friendships on in these teams, right? Yeah. Massively. Yeah. However, your competing against each other really? When it comes down to it?

Dave Harvey  20:49  
Yeah, yeah, definitely. Like, we, I don't think you ever hate someone in your team. And it's funny enough, because I got along really well with most of the guys in my position, or that were directly competing with you probably because we spend a lot of time a lot of time with them. But on the flip side, you um, yeah, you're competing with them, because there's almost like three players per position. So but if you can play it, you know, a few positions, you probably got a little edge, but yeah, definitely comparable time. But then you've also got to compete with them. You know, through your recovery through your rehab, through your video analysis of your game through the view video analysis of the game coming up, you know, what your opposition players doing.

Nick Papastamatis  21:26  
So what is a video analysis comprise of like, it sounds like it's an important part. It'd be like me analyzing the performance of the clinic. Yeah. It'd be like you need to be super objective. Is that like, what are you what are you breaking down?

Dave Harvey  21:40  
So usually what we do say let's just say we play Saturday night, Sunday would be off your travel everywhere playing away would have to check in for medicals do recoveries, you know, recovery session, the pool, if we are playing at home we usually get Sunday off, chill out. And then Mondays we'll check in do another medical and then we'll sit down in the in the cinema, cinema room and just watch the video we like sweet the coaches would break it up. And you guys these are these are the good stuff we did these the bad stuff. These are work ons, we should have done this, this here, your body positioned wrong. If you you know a little bit more angled to your right, or you took the ball to the line a little bit more than that create space x, you know, for XYZ. And then that'd be Mondays and then would go on the field, do weights. And then come back Tuesday. And then probably Tuesday afternoon, we'll start to look at the other team. But before that you have a room like this that we're in now. And there'd be computers all around, you can load up your game and just watch your highlights. And then you'd have to critique your own game as well. I would Yeah, make notes and then and relay back to the coaches. 

Nick Papastamatis  22:43  
Were you part because sometimes when I watch myself back on a video, when I've done like a, like some sort of instructional or something. I'm literally like sometimes I don't want to watch it. Would you be sometimes watching yourself playing guy? 

Jac Simmonds  22:59  
What were you doing?

Dave Harvey  23:01  
I mean, we may be playing a game as you're playing, we're playing the rebels and watched a video analysis. And he's like, Dave, what are you doing? I was like, I don't know.

Yeah, bloke made a break. And he was he was through and then all I had to do was support him. And I just like good break.

Jac Simmonds  23:21  
the biggest spray of if anyone was in my very short experience with you know, professional sport, but like, are always remember, I was 10 minutes late to a video, like the meeting and I've never caught the biggest spray like the amount of secrecy they hold around these videos. I don't know if it was the same in rugby union. But like, I absolutely copped it from my coach for being 10 minutes late that day, it's like it's in front of the team in front of the team. It's like this, it's like this. It's valued really highly in professional sport. And something I was actually listening to recently was the Melbourne Storm, who are sort of benchmarked as the as the example in rugby league, they've actually started here, they've actually started the video analysis, they don't actually watch the game, they just watch training, and they reward efforts in training now, which is pretty cool to hear as well. So that does make sense. Because if you if the effort levels are high in training, yeah, we've ever the levels are high in training, you're going to carry that truck or that learned experience into the game because the games are gonna pan out the way you want them to.

Exactly. So they're actually not not analyzing any of the any of the actual game, which is good.

Nick Papastamatis  24:32  
Yeah, well, it's also backed in the research, where even with rehab video analysis is a great external tool that you can use to provide your client with feedback on what they're doing right and wrong. Mm hmm. And same goes with the sports, sports teams like it's, of course, you're going to get feedback on what you've done right and wrong, like that's, you know what you did in that moment. You know, you weren't thinking about x, y and z.

Jac Simmonds  24:58  
You can see the moment in front of you. It's just another cutthroat nature professional sport, right? Like, yeah, I suppose, 

Dave Harvey  25:03  
but even not a professional sport. So I did a bit of coaching two years ago coached as assistant first grade at Gordon, so back where I was playing club rugby. And every Sunday, over the weekend, by by Monday afternoon, I'd have to cut up all the kicking opportunities throughout the game. So all the broken play kicking, kick off and shot to goal. And I'd have to, you know, do a couple of good ones, but got do a couple work on not bad ones always caught on work on and then provide feedback on what we should have done in that position. And this is at a semi professional level, just to gear them up. So when they do get in the professional environment is they're not getting absolute rude shock.

Jac Simmonds  25:40  
So I'd be interested and we spoke about it a little bit before, but throughout your life professional rugby career, what your experience with strengthing and conditioning was interesting. Yeah,

Dave Harvey  25:50  
yeah. Very interesting. So I remember, probably the first good, well not good experience. First experiences is English dude, who was just massive. Probably to cut it short. I had, I've had about two good trainers in my whole career. And I've played for a lot of clubs, if everyone's listening, and everyone knows that. I bet Yeah. And those guys really knew what they're on about. One guy called Darren he was phenomenal. He was early on about 2007 2008. And then funny enough to the Brazilian guys looking looking back on them. The Brazilian national Yeah, Brazilian national sevens, sevens and 15 side, their their strength and conditioning program was phenomenal. Something, that I probably didn't buy into as much as I should have. Because I always thought that everyone in Australia knew a little bit more about that kind of stuff. But no, I am thinking back on it now at the time, like you put a lot of trust in these guys. But looking back on it now it's like, well, no, I didn't need to benchpress the whole time. I didn't do you know lat pulldown. I didn't need a deadlift and squat the most it needed to be a practical movement in need to be a skill. I need to learn movements that were that were needed in the sport or in everyday life. Yes. But we never really had a bad, I actually had some horrible people in France. I had this physio once who just put his hands above my belly and just kept them there, that didn't touch me.

Jac Simmonds  27:17  
Reiki.

Nick Papastamatis  27:18  
Well, yeah, what For how long?

Dave Harvey  27:21  
Six minutes. 

Jac Simmonds  27:22  
employed by the club?

Dave Harvey  27:23  
yeah. I had a sore back. It's when I first hurt my back. End agenda. He was just like, Mr. Miyagi. Wow. I was like, is that you bet on that...no. Yeah. Thanks. So so he just and this at a club? Professional unbeliev... about five or six. Maybe it was just, you know, the mindset guy. there but yeah,

Nick Papastamatis  27:45  
psychologists.

Dave Harvey  27:47  
Actually, maybe you just you just working for that day just coming from it. 

Jac Simmonds  27:50  
Yeah, really.

Dave Harvey  27:53  
But yes, conditioning. I wouldn't say bad experiences. But I wouldn't say I learned a lot. I've learned more in the last probably four to six years through my business in my own learning some main research, through you guys, probably more through you guys to be honest. Then I have over a course of 10 or so years of training, I was never taught how to squat properly. I was never taught how to deadlift properly. I definitely wasn't taught how to clean properly. Don't need snatching in football anyway, but I'll definitely not taught how to do so for that. We weren't taught mobility or the importance of rolling and recovery. As I think I mentioned off air that our recovery used to be after the game. Let's do you know 10x 20 minute jog throughs and have a stretch and go on the sheds. And then the next day a...

Jac Simmonds  28:36  
That's become much more popular in the last couple years. Yeah, hello, athletes recover sleep nutrition. And yeah, 10-15 years ago, yeah. Even nutrition.

Dave Harvey  28:45  
Yeah, like I remember when I was playing rugby league for the bunnies. The south sydney. A long time ago when I was young before I kind of went to cricket mmm to rugby. And just that time played to the bunnies. Yeah. We were there the nutrition guy came in he probably he's probably changed my mindset but I was eating like ... from his advice. I used to. I used to get to Winston Hill shops. So to go to bunnies training, he get a bus from baulkham hills. Yes. To Parramatta station get on the train, go to Redfern then go to erskineville and then go to training and then go home the exact same way. Oh, four days, four days a week. It was just because my mom like the bunnies. I did it for a year. He goes bunny support. mums are fanatic. Oh, mom's number plate says be you and and one three bunny. Bunny.

She was on a billboard at a mascot to the airport. With like one of those RTA my plates as we drove past one day.

Nick Papastamatis  29:44  
Was it really green as well. The car know the number.

Dave Harvey  29:47  
Yeah, it's one of those team number places. Yeah, well, yeah, but I am. I used to get every single shots by six white bread rolls three bananas, brown sugar and have six sandwiches on the way to training. Just because I was told to carb load as much as I could. Well, that's

Nick Papastamatis  30:01  
definitely some carb loading right there

Dave Harvey  30:05  
Sat on the train and ate my banana sandwiches.

Nick Papastamatis  30:07  
it's what an athlete does.... wonderful things. athlete. What would you do differently then? If you if you looked at yourself as a hang on, if you looked at yourself as a 20 year old, you're in you're in Europe 2021 22 now, yeah, 1020 Yeah, so pretend like let's just, yeah, let's teleport you back at in 2020?

Dave Harvey  30:32  
was gonna say what do I do differently back then? I shouldn't do anything because I'm pretty, pretty happy where I am at the moment, which is pretty cool. What's led you here? But yeah, it's got me to where I am family and you know, business and yeah, brewed coffee. I'd research, I'll do more. I learned as what I tell my clients that I got there's not one diet or one or dont even call it a diet. There's not one lifestyle and nutrition that is right for everyone. You know, like I will, as you told me, this is like, not everyone kind of has to squat the same everyones hips a different you know, my anchor my mobility my ankles, poor. I probably learned my notes and experiment was I will take notes that's worked for me really well. I felt like this after I trained. Yeah, I felt like this after I played and then I flipped. So I used to train Friday night before I played a game on Saturday. Right? If I had that. If I had my time over again. I wouldn't have trained after Wednesday or Thursday morning. Yes. And if I was playing on Saturday, even Thursday, I probably would have done with some light stuff, mobility, maybe some light explosive stuff and did nothing for the rest of the day. Nothing Friday.

Nick Papastamatis  31:37  
Did you ever take a diary? Like use a diary?

Dave Harvey  31:39  
No, nothing. I would have taken notes would have mapped everything would have tracked numbers. I would have researched probably. I wouldn't have researched everyone because everyone has a bloody opinion in 2020 Yes, I would have researched people that are like minded to myself, who kind of fit within my bubble, and then I would have adopted what they thought was right. Yes. And then I would have like probably tried to implement that into lifestyle training. Playing. Yes. Yeah,

Nick Papastamatis  32:07  
you definitely Yeah, sorry. You're gonna know you definitely as as an athlete, to what I've heard you need to do the research. You need to experiment you take notes. Yeah.

Jac Simmonds  32:16  
I think and I think in your early 20s as well, you just not asking questions, not enough like to strength and conditioning coaches to physios just not questioning just trusting

Dave Harvey  32:27  
Yeah, most of the guys like most of the guys you're playing around more experienced, you know, some big names even when I was 29 going to the western force like I go to training and there's people like David Pocock there he and the best probably if not as good as Hooper or on the same page, maybe even better, you know, at his time and we had eight nine Wallabies there who got along really well. But it's like, why would a question anything like

Jac Simmonds  32:51  
He's a machine aswell. Yeah,

Dave Harvey  32:54  
I'm doing what I'm doing what they're doing. So I was like, what, you know, it's if it's right for them. It's right for me.

Jac Simmonds  33:00  
Yeah. Yeah. But that's the thing as well in clubs, like there is a bit of a generalized approach to training like there's, how many blocks in a squad? You can individually you can individualize as much as you want. But there's one s&c mostly to clubs. And you know, which

Nick Papastamatis  33:14  
that's interesting. Yeah. Yeah, I know, I work with the roosters. And I know that they've got a head of performance, but I know that there's several people working and reviewing the program all the time, and they've even got externals coming in as well. Okay. That don't quote me on but yes, they they on and off work with people externally, too. So it's like, I think there's full transparency but then it's not one person only. Yeah, that is in charge of, you know, the program. It's got it. It's got to be 

Dave Harvey  33:43  
Yeah, because that one person is there one person's ideas might be quite, you know, I wouldn't say narrow minded but tunnel vision. Yeah.

Nick Papastamatis  33:50  
And you've got a 30 man squad. Hey, Nick, how you supposed to have such a diverse range of understanding knowledge to be able to know where every one of those 30 are without dividing and conquering with a team? Yeah, sure. The team has to be controlled by a team Sure. Man so well, now what I mean you played rugby union you then said you played for Brazil?

Dave Harvey  34:11  
Yeah, I was lucky enough to play for Brazil, so mum is Brazilian, I think so Brazil held the Olympics 2016 which was supposed to go on but you know, things often say took a turn for the worse. I made a pretty calculated decision not to go but now Yeah, my mom was Brazil mom was born in Brazil, grandparents were born in Brazil. So I, they made contact with me somehow when I was playing Super Rugby and figured out I was Brazilian, and that they got me into this, like, you know want you come over, train with us. And then we'll put you in the Olympic squad. So it's pretty much a free ticket to the Olympics. 2014 I went to Brazil for the World Cup. I had opened F45 castlehill in May 2014. At the end of May, four days later went to Brazil for six weeks.

Nick Papastamatis  34:57  
Jesus

Dave Harvey  34:58  
which is ready, but we're supposed to open up February but I blame I blame hills council Yes, I went over so we pretty much didn't do anything for six weeks at Castle Hill, um yes I went to Brazil went to World Cup now FIFA World Cup, enjoy that time with them and then went on the Sevens circuit with them which is pretty cool played some Test matches played some ten a side games, which is good experience. Something that you know, I didn't get to do playing for the Australia...you know, rugby plays golden pie for Australia but I got to I was actually the first ever player in sevens rugby history to play for two nations.

Nick Papastamatis  35:33  
That's pretty cool. Yeah. So Brazil sevens and Australian sevens.

Dave Harvey  35:36  
Yeah. Wow. That's pretty freakin awesome. They changed the law. So you had to wait two years, two years before you play for other countries to change it, which I was lucky enough. Yeah, I got through. But yeah, yeah. And then I was supposed to go to the Olympics in 2016 actually snap ankle in my first sevens tournament which is... scored to try and felt something go really weird. I still got the photo.

Jac Simmonds  35:38  
what was the injury? What was the injury? 

Dave Harvey  35:58  
A lot I think I pretty much ruptured a 3/4/5 ligaments to the ankle say a lateral ankle reconstruction I think deltoid ligament was was in half, which I actually don't think they're repaired and then screw fixation through syndesmosis I remember getting the MRI you see... I did the injury and they did everything yeah did everything yeah. They didn't go through the middle Yeah, they got an ingoal judge at sevens. he's like come on mate move like beat it I can't move. anyway so I kind of like army crawled off 

Jac Simmonds  36:30  
that's all your passive structures in your ankle nearly a lot of...

Dave Harvey  36:33  
Army crawled off put a boot on so I went to the medical room around Yeah, gave got on the blower put a boot on

Nick Papastamatis  36:42  
there's no dislocation

Dave Harvey  36:44  
Nup walked out. Yeah. woke up the next morning went to the after party. woke up the next morning it was huge. like purple, saw the physio goes I think it's a bad sprain because that anyway oh flew home so yeah, thanks, buddy.

Jac Simmonds  36:58  
Well he wasn't wrong. Very bad sprain.

Dave Harvey  37:04  
Yeah, but fun not flew home it flew out business cards which is good. So the fate was flee directly to Sydney went back to work. So I went to F45 high and limped around walked on it. Yeah, for about 8 day's work. This is not right. This is very, very painful. Got an MRI, they only showed the lateral and the deltoid that was gone. didn't show the syndesmosis. I think it's just too much swelling, too much swelling. Yeah. And then I woke up to the surgeon going. The first words I heard was screw fixation. Screw fixation. So I was about nine, nine months out. Yeah. mobility scooter for three, three months. 

Nick Papastamatis  37:31  
It's a massive surgery. People usually know when they've done something more than just a normal sprain to the ankle. Every syndesmosis injury I've dealt with the pain the person is usually like there's something weird about this one. Yeah, that's what they say.

Jac Simmonds  37:44  
And that weird feeling is that comes about later as well I find that separating around the six to eight week mark they're like something's not right. If I hadn't had the diagnosis.

Dave Harvey  38:06  
Mine was mine was about Yeah, mine's about two weeks later. I was I actually had my foot up resting I was doing to be teaching at Crestwood High another teaching job. Crestwood High enough I'm in pain he went home the head teachers from PE's I bet you can't get home I'm like mate, I'm going home. See your teacher? Yeah, gun did my teaching degrees I graduated bachelor physical education. So just in case just in case you got injured playing rugby say a little back up.

Jac Simmonds  38:30  
Yeah, did that cross over with F45? 

Dave Harvey  38:32  
Nah, not really. Yeah. Yeah, long long before I graduated in 2002. So I did a lot I did a fair bit of teaching on and off between Europe and footy here also just casual never had a full time job. Yeah, got really sore. something wasn't right and my tip and fever miles apart. Yeah. talking like three to three inches apart there.

Nick Papastamatis  38:52  
It's it's and that's I think that might be why with depending on how they they fixated. You may or may not need to fix the deltoid.

Dave Harvey  39:01  
Yeah, they didn't actually got the screw out, though. So they put the screw in. Yeah. Because I wanted to go back to playing because I want to go to the Olympics. The surgeon took the screw out. He was actually he was a legend his names. Dr. Quo ... Rob Quo.

Nick Papastamatis  39:14  
Yeah, he's in the hills.

Dave Harvey  39:15  
Yeah. So I got I got him off. One of the guys at Cronula sharks. He did think he did a couple of boys there. And I called him up on the 16th of December, I think or maybe a 18th of December. He's like, I'm going on holidays on the 23rd you booked in for the 22nd. Got me come in four days later, like a trip. Yeah, it was um, it's interesting. What a kind of I get lead my passageway to all my injuries. Hmm. First big injury, so pretty incredible...

Jac Simmonds  39:47  
Yeah. 32...32 and first major injury 32

Dave Harvey  39:52  
Yeah. 32 I actually didn't miss I missed one game in my whole career through an AC joint. Yep. And then Yeah, that was probably a good 14 seasons at club rugby and super rugby and Europe as well.

Nick Papastamatis  40:07  
yeah, and this is this we've we've touched on this a number of times Jacko. And sometimes like, just, you know that you're you're gonna like your true born because you're not getting injured like these, like you have basically bulletproof and like you can do anything you can do whatever you want, and you're not, falling apart, you get the right leverages, you've got the right. athleticism, you got the right tissues, you got the right mindset.

Dave Harvey  40:34  
And I think that comes back to my family as well. So I kind of my upbringing and through through the history of the family and so

Nick Papastamatis  40:39  
if that's if that is the if that's the first obstacle surely that's not the only obstacle

Dave Harvey  40:44  
Nah mostly other obstacles were mental mate, to be honest. probably still a little bit scarred from it in to a certain extent. Okay. Early on, like my mind, like, my mindset from sport was like, I want to play professionally. I remember at school like everyone would pick on you because you want to be an athlete. You want... Really? Yeah, it's a little bit different. But

Nick Papastamatis  41:01  
you had a performance performing arts school.

Dave Harvey  41:03  
Yeah, but most of like, hollein of them were there before, like, there was there was a niche for that. But there's another like there's, you know, just everyday, everyday Joe,

Nick Papastamatis  41:11  
what sort of things would they pick on you in terms of Oh,

Dave Harvey  41:13  
just like, you know, I try and do well in PE and, you know, try and excel at the sport I do. And they'd be like our mate, look at you trying too hard and stuff like that. But back in my day, they had gymnastics. If I had my time again, I would have done gymnastics I would have done everything.

Nick Papastamatis  41:27  
Yes. I here that very often. Yeah. A lot of athletes now. would say if I had my time again, I'd probably go do gymnastics.

Dave Harvey  41:35  
gymnastics, dancing. Everything that was frowned upon when I was at school. Yes. And made to look like you were like, below everyone else. I wouldn't even say girl because girls are stronger than more mobile and more athletic than most men. Yes. They're probably started off then. And then it kind of led into my whole career. So I played I was lucky enough to play first grade when I was 18. For Parramatta. I she was the first ever shield player to wear white boots. Well, yes, I played rugby. And so I played rugby league for the bunnies u18s.

Jac Simmonds  42:07  
massive thing. 

Dave Harvey  42:08  
Oh, man, it was a tv game as well and they were saying it like who is this kid?

Jac Simmonds  42:12  
my old man...

Dave Harvey  42:15  
There's no black boots anymore. That's right pink and they're yellow and green. And actually, I should do it all right, I asked for it. I got man of the match score. 22 points when white boots are probably I don't think I've wore black boots ever. Wow.

Nick Papastamatis  42:27  
And then from now you don't even notice what color the boots?

Dave Harvey  42:30  
Just you know they're not. They're black. You actually notice black though? Why is he wearing black boots? Boring.

Jac Simmonds  42:34  
Yeah.

Dave Harvey  42:38  
Um, yeah. And and I guess from there, I thought I was light, as low as 74 kilos. 75 maybe 76 playing first grade rugby. And I remember one of the coaches wanted me in the Waratahs setup. And every Waratahs home team. You know, I'd go to rugby games when I was a young kid and watch the Waratahs and I got the feedback. Someone said mate, you're too small. You need to get heavier. So I was I I do what I do what you asked me to do and I got up to 85/86 kilos, would you put on 15 now that 10 to 12 kilos of good weight so lift lifted. Yeah, pretty short timeframe. Probably about probably about a season. Yeah. Lifting pretty heavy. Maybe I was squatting heavy. Like really heavy like much more than I can actually squat now. Yes. And probably not the right way. Yeah, so we're talking 220 on the bar.

Nick Papastamatis  43:29  
It's heavy. That's too heavy.

Dave Harvey  43:31  
I do that now in my training I'd turn into an accordion. But yeah, so like I got heavy I got heavy and put on weight. I didn't lose too much of like my skill set in terms of kicking in and then I said sweet, I'm at the weight you want me to be that and nah we don't want you.

Jac Simmonds  43:46  
Yeah, you know yeah. And so then because professional sport is a game of now as well like you need to be available now and whatever we need right now is what you need to be.

Dave Harvey  43:56  
you know, so I kind of rather than taking that you know, and being disheartened. I took it on the chin is like sweet. I'll prove you wrong. Played... left Parramatta and went to Gordon to try and get more recognition. Yes, but left to a like a mid table club. did pretty well there for a couple years and then 2008 we killed it. 2008 2009 We destroyed the competition, we led the semi final by 10 points. With two and a half minutes to go and we lost, they brought three Wallabies off the bench and we lost. Nonetheless that one player of the year that year in 2008 super excited. So sweet. This is my calling. Contract time... nothing. 2009 came third nothing, 2010 came 3rd.... nothing why 2011 a won player of the year again and my agent called me up he's like Do not be a prick to the media. Daily telegraph was there and they're like so do you think you deserve a super rugby contract? I was like Yeah, I do. And I was pretty blunt in a nice way. You know it can be a little bit...

Nick Papastamatis  44:59  
but I'll be too Yeah, point you sort of like, Well, I'm not getting anywhere by being nice.

Dave Harvey  45:03  
I think I was I think I was fed up. Yeah. Melbourne rebels bought in a team at the time and they made a shortlist of 120 players. I wasn't on the shortlist. Yes. And I was and there's no other closer for those guys that don't know much about club rugby. There's no other. There's no other. There's no other club rugby in Australia. There's Brisbane, which is not massive. There's Perth, which is minimal. But everything's in Sydney. It's on TV. Yes, Shute Shield. And that's where they usually pick from and that's where we talked, we spoke about the private school pathway. Yeah. Is that that plucking them out of private school straight from year 12 into the setup and then just graduate them from from there into the team.

Jac Simmonds  45:41  
Do you reckon that was some of that leftover, maybe stereotyping prejudice that was still there from...

Dave Harvey  45:46  
 I think so. Yeah, I think a lot of coaches be like, Alright, well, favorites. Why wasn't he in the team? I think I think questions get asked is like, Well, why wasn't he in the team five years ago? And that carries carries on with you rather than just them looking at you on merit? Yeah, that happened to look at his history that happened to a lot of our team in 2008/09 we finished second and we did a lot of damage in their competition. And looking back from those squads. I think only myself and one other went on to play see rugby. out of about a squad of 17.

Jac Simmonds  46:15  
That's interesting. Is Yeah, it sounds like it is very real, then. Yeah, this whole thing is interesting. Yeah, for sure. So I guess let's uh, let's fast forward to the I guess the next part of your life, which is after footy. But before we do, like when you did eventually retire from rugby union, how did you find it? Did you find it easy to retire?

Dave Harvey  46:34  
I think I did. Yeah, I am. So post injury I made a comeback got injured again. We're still chasing the Olympic dream, I guess. And then it would have been we were we play Canada. And then I was in Hong Kong played Hong Kong sevens and the end of Hong Kong sevens I signed a contract to, to move to Brazil at the end of June and only stay there for July and play the Olympics in August and come home. At the end of March, the coach said we need you in Brazil in two weeks. And you've got to stay there. Oh, changed the game yeah. And I was like, Nah, can't do that. I've just openned a new business. And he's like, you have to be there. So I went back at a thought I said, If I leave in the business crashes, all I've gotten is Olympic ring tattooed on my arm. Yeah. And that's it. When I made the decision, I said no I'm out. He's like sweets. They take a squad of 12 he goes your 13th man and someone gets injured you're in. I was like, well, I've got a bit of a chance. And then I think up until June, I'd say I was playing club rugby. So played a little bit of club rugby. Just to keep myself fit. And the coach called me up with about two weeks to go before Olympics he goes one of our players has strained his hamstrings. I was like, oh, and then he goes we'll know in 2-3 days how bad it is. And he called up. He said it's not bad. I said right. Not a problem. So I settled with my decision. And then yeah, that's pretty pretty much when I made the cause I was not meant to be I've chosen my pathway. Now. You already had this setup before. Yeah, yeah. So I chose it. And I was a bit annoyed that it was gone against our original agreement. But by the end of the day, I look back now then we wouldn't have had my daughter. Same time. Yeah. All right. Yeah. So early August, I think. And then she was born you know the year after. So

Nick Papastamatis  48:10  
that's beautiful. 

Dave Harvey  48:11  
Yeah, I was pretty lucky. So yeah, my decision to retire,

Nick Papastamatis  48:13  
just blessings everywhere Really? Like, you know, that's awesome. So I think um, so you've so it sounds like you've looked good. Obviously, there's a lot of fruit there. I know that you've done your more recently, you've done a lot of F45 you've been competing in F45. And you've started to push towards CrossFit. But I suppose getting told you're not good enough. And getting knocked back several times. Yeah, it sounds like even after you've proved yourself Yeah. getting knocked back. And then opening a business, I suppose. Are you still an athlete?

Dave Harvey  48:48  
Yeah, I like to think so. I like to think so. It's probably what I'm kind of chasing what I'm doing now. What are you chasing? I want to make the CrossFit Games it's a goal that you have very minimal amount of humans can do obviously want to do it in the Masters region, you know, because I've only been there a year to make the games at an open level you need to be doing the sport for multiple years Yes, multiple years and I'm learning new stuff like at the moment that stuff that I've never learned before and this stuff that I've have done before but there needs to be redefined. See Yeah, there's something I'm changing a bit. You can be for me the athlete name is can be overused okay. But it's also mindset for me like you You can be a professional athlete or you can be you can kind of be an athlete in your in your own right but you need to have everything in order to be an athlete you can't go to macca's drive thru and then go go you know, and call yourself an athlete you need it you need to be able to sleep you need to be able to eat well you need to be able to understand understand your body live the lifestyle but yeah, I like to think Ampler obviously not getting paid doing what I'm doing. A lot of time not a commitment. Yeah, pain, pain from my coach, which which understands me which is really cool. But yeah, so that's kind of what I'm doing at the moment after getting and Funny enough, like getting knocked back so much early on in rugby has kind of drip fed into, like my mindset at the moment. So I've done a lot of self work, a lot of mindset work a lot of NET therapy, which is, yeah, which is really quite fun. That was relaly helpfull. 

Nick Papastamatis  50:22  
Neuro emotional technique.

Dave Harvey  50:23  
Yeah. So it just kind of helps deal with past traumas. And you know, whether it be something that's going on now there's a, there's an original event where it's occurred from a lot of my traumas, a based around my family in my stepdad, which I spoke about, but b rugby. Rugby is caused a lot of trauma being told you're not good enough. And that's transitioned into my training, right? So I'll get to a point where I said, do a 10 minute amrap. And I'll be like, sweet, I can do six rounds here. Easy. And I'll get to the fourth round and go I'm not good enough to do this. I'm not enough to get to six. 

Nick Papastamatis  50:54  
And it might not be the front of like, I'm not in your head, right, obviously. But it might not be those words. It might be, oh my fucking shoulder.

Dave Harvey  51:03  
Yep. Yep. Spot on. It's like, Oh, my quads is lactic acid in my quads yes, or I'm not breathing right. I'll just have to stop or Yeah, but you know, back feels a bit weird. Yes. Something like that.

Nick Papastamatis  51:15  
So it's, that's the thing that that I'm not good enough thing. Yeah. That fear of belief or that lack of belief, self worth that fear of failure, that the people that are two weeks out from an event that have this crippling injury, that they could have had a crippling injury this whole time, You've decided to have a niggle two weeks before? Yeah. And that's the thing that's, that's that, 

Jac Simmonds  51:40  
especially in CrossFit because CrossFit is more than anything like a pain tolerance. Oh, yeah. Massive sport, right. Like in some of and you know, as well, Nicko, and myself, like seeing crossfitters, who are at a high level, the one thing that separates a lot of them is their ability to put themselves in a position where they're in a lot of pain. Yes. And stay there. Yep. Yeah. And that takes a certain type of mindset, right? And probably what you're talking about Dave, like, it takes an athlete mindset.

Dave Harvey  52:05  
Yeah. This this, though, and I tell my clients is when we whenever we do an F 45 session, or make things really hard, or we do you know, f45 games and stuff like that. There's two types of mindsets I see in my studio, there's a couple of police officers in my studio, and the ones in the gang squad and once in the Drug Squad, and then right there next, and I've got a few military so they're next level up here. Yes. The next level, like dedicated focus, you see it in their training? Yeah. So I'm gonna push a little bit hard. And they're like, Okay, let's do it. And there's other people everyday josha there to tick a box and move, which is fantastic, and so happy that they're doing something. And the flip side is this athletes and those athletes have the ability to isolate, I'm going to flick it on, we're going to move fast, it's going to hurt. But once you're done, there's no more pain. Yeah, like you're recovering. And the best bit of or not so much advisor, but this thing I was trying to think about, if you're training, and it's hard for 10 minutes, you're gonna feel exactly the same. At the 15 minute mark is if you tried really hard at it for 10 minutes, or if you tried at a medium level for 10 minutes, you're gonna recover, you're gonna feel exactly the same.

Nick Papastamatis  53:13  
Once it's done once it's done.

Dave Harvey  53:15  
Five minutes later, 10 years later, you're gonna feel

Nick Papastamatis  53:17  
I feel like some regardless of how hard you go,

Jac Simmonds  53:19  
yeah, I feel like sometimes CrossFit may over reward that as well. That's the flip side.

Nick Papastamatis  53:24  
Yeah, I think. I think um, I think that the, you know, and we're, we're about to ask you a question of, well, how are you meant to train? I suppose when it comes to the flip side. Sorry, what was the saying? The the members of the gym, your general cohort, Gen pop. CrossFit definitely, at large in encouraging the intensity and that intensity is probably at f45 does too to some extent,

Dave Harvey  53:57  
I'd say depend depends on the owners. Yeah,

Nick Papastamatis  53:59  
yeah. Now, what percentage of your Gen pop do you think are ready for that type of intensity? Three? Yeah, like 3% is like such a small percentage. If so, if you see someone completely screwed on the floor, and they get high fives and it's a lot of cheerleading you know, celebrating the fact that all your all your members are screwed now. And that's because they worked so hard. Do you think that's Wait, how long do you think that candle can burn for?

Dave Harvey  54:28  
Like, may I say with my client, so we actually don't i don't jump in studio anymore. Okay. A because we're for good thing they'll all end up here. You don't jump. We do a lot of plyometric stuff at f45. Yeah. I kind of take it away because it's not conducive to your everyday. No, yeah. What would you say everyday athlete? I'd say everyday. Yeah. Mother, father, husband, wife. Yeah. son, daughter. It doesn't last long. It lasted there's a six to eight week period with people end up getting I've got a, I've got a problem of knee or going from the low back. Yes. And CrossFit gets a bad name. And f45 gets a bad name because of knees and backs. Because of that jumping, which we eliminated in terms of our clientel retention, and our percentage of clients turn up to train, but we're doing pretty good, really well. And I think CrossFit gets a really bad name because you get a lot of injuries from CrossFit. It gets a bad name because everyone tries to race that finish line. So they lose or snatch technique they lose all clean technqiue either lose or deadlift, and they lose whatever they're doing at the time. They lose it all. Because they don't know back to you,r question. They don't know how to train. Yes, well, they're not taught how to train.

Nick Papastamatis  55:45  
Yeah, definitely. And they also a lot of the time, they don't know how to how to race against the clock properly. Yeah, yeah, they trying to do snatches too quickly. Yeah. But they don't they forget that the stimulus with what stimulus we're trying to achieve, it's not actually doesn't matter who wins. It's the stimulus that we're trying to achieve.

Dave Harvey  56:03  
That's the point funny funny. So that so I trained in my class on Friday morning, I turned up and I take Friday mornings off. So when I'm trying to 630 class turned up. And at the end of the session, I just try and you know, nice smooth session. I said a couple boys, we can do a little finish up. We know 500 meter row. We're going to go off the rower, go for a block, run, and we're going to finish with 20 burpees. Yes. All right. And I said, pace yourself. Don't try and break a world record on the rower and then we'll we'll finish at a similar time. So I've done the row. And then right next to me, Matty trying to break the world record. Just rowing at like 128 134 I'm just sitting at 145 just nice smooth strokes. Yeah. And he's he's got he's

Nick Papastamatis  56:42  
So for me maybe 215.

Dave Harvey  56:44  
He's gone. He's gone at 145 then he's gone. 155 Yeah, gone. 135. And then he's got a 210.

Jac Simmonds  56:50  
Anyway, oh, no,

Dave Harvey  56:51  
he ended up finishing way later. 65 seconds behind me. I was like, that's the thing that What are you trying to achieve? We're not trying to sprint to the finish line here we can give a different stimulus.

Jac Simmonds  57:04  
From my personal experience with CrossFit, when it's the people who are attracted to CrossFit gym, like can sometimes be very competitive. And then when you've got to work out that's defined as for time or amrap. Those imply 100%. Right. Like, they imply that you go into it.

Nick Papastamatis  57:20  
I wonder what they said, what they would say is if if you just said you're going to do you've got 20 minutes to do this? Well, that's if they just said that. Yeah. 100% rather than try and do this in six minutes in six minutes. Yeah. And like, that way. It's like you can still, like if it's if it's 20 minute workout. That's, that's a that's an aerobic workout. Yeah. Like, if you're going to be in a robot, if you're going to be an aerobic state, then, I mean, obviously, there's science behind this, but you've got to sit 65 to 75% max heart rate. Yeah, like, the whole time Not, not try and not try and win. Yeah, because if you try and win, you're gonna go past your anaerobic threshold. Yeah, definitely. Then you're gonna it's you've turned the change the stimulus completely. Yeah.

Jac Simmonds  58:06  
Well, separate from that as well. Like, where do you see people go wrong in in the other side of it, which is recovery nutrition. 

Dave Harvey  58:12  
Oh everywhere. recovery. I'm still learning. Yes. And I still need to adapt. And that's one of my work on ... what's new there? in regards to recovery for me. Yeah, doing it. 

Nick Papastamatis  58:25  
Oh, you weren't doing any recovery? Well,

Dave Harvey  58:27  
I wasn't taught how to recover I was it was not a learning learning experience on how to recover

Nick Papastamatis  58:34  
Jacko has just dropped dropped a glass of water cuz he's wet all the cords. This is the shit show. What's going on? Hey, jack. Oh, yeah, let's keep talking. Yeah, so

Dave Harvey  58:48  
I wasn't I wasn't. I wasn't taught. I wasn't taught how to recover. Right. So I wasn't taught how to work on mobility. I wasn't taught how to stretch and roll wasn't taught the importance of sleep. I wasn't taught that meditation could be good for you. I wasn't taught that the mind the mindset.

Nick Papastamatis  59:07  
Well, how much did you leave on the table here as an athlete?

Dave Harvey  59:11  
Shitloads probably 30% Yeah. 60% natural ability. Or maybe this this a 50% natural ability 20% hard work 30% recovery, knowledge and content, but now my now there's a huge importance on my sleep. Thanks to my whoop, our whoop, yeah. Huge important disclosure

Nick Papastamatis  59:31  
I noticed that you are a fan of the Whoop.

Dave Harvey  59:34  
Whoop/Dave Harvey17 for your link. But ya know that like the best ways to recover are for me, spend depends what you're working. If this is heavy upper body session, heavy lower body session, spend five to eight minutes and that's all it takes. Have a nice little roll through your shoulders. You know, through your shoulders, through your hips hammies whatever it is, but sleep Yes, sleep is key

Nick Papastamatis  59:58  
So how many hours a night are you getting? 

Dave Harvey  59:59  
Not Enough. We've got a child. Monday, Wednesday, Friday a little bit sporadic. But Thursdays I like to get to bed at 730/8 o'clock. Early.

Jac Simmonds  1:00:08  
Yeah. What do you do?

Dave Harvey  1:00:11  
Yeah, that's why these can't go for too much longer. I got to get to bed but no recoveries... So if you have no time to recover, make sure you sleep. Yes, use sleep as your recovery. Apart from that it all comes down to food. You eat raw, that's recovery. It's food for performance. 

Nick Papastamatis  1:00:30  
So how would you prioritize it? So if you've got food, sleep, and mobile or recovery post, like post workout? What would you say would be the the absolute no brainer, you have to get this right?

Dave Harvey  1:00:42  
All of them. But if you had to delete one, 

Nick Papastamatis  1:00:46  
I'm not happy with that answer.

Dave Harvey  1:00:48  
If you had to delete one, you'd take out the mobility, okay? Because sleep is a non negotiable, okay? Because it just sets your whole mindset. If you've got enough sleep enough recovery in your whoops in the green if you don't have a whoop if you you know, you're feeling good in the morning. Yeah, you're tuned to the day you're tuned to your clients, you guys, you know, you're picking injuries up you're seeing something that you you're not supposed to be seeing. 100%

Nick Papastamatis  1:01:12  
Yeah. So if you had a choice between a terrible diet today or a great sleep

Dave Harvey  1:01:19  
I would take the good diet. Okay, and have a shitty sleep. Why? Because a bad diet has flow on effect. You got your guts your second brain, Yes. So you can under sleep and have a okay mindset but if you eat shit food have a good sleep you are gonna feel crap for the next 24 hours

Jac Simmonds  1:01:36  
Yeh with sleep, I guess it comes down to the chronic under sleeping as well. Doesn't it? Like one night? I guess not too bad. If you're stringing together a lot of nights. Yes. Yes. Six, seven hours.

Nick Papastamatis  1:01:45  
In other words, you've got to dial it in. Yeah, yeah. And you need to go to get your rhythm gun. Would you recommend like so? I suppose you How old are you now?

Dave Harvey  1:01:54  
38

Nick Papastamatis  1:01:55  
so you're 38 You don't look a day over 25 Thank you. I haven't shaved. No, that's okay. It's it. That's the ruggedness. Yeah. You obviously don't look 38 that's still young. Anyway. I'm not far off. But in terms of

Jac Simmonds  1:02:11  
No you don't.

Nick Papastamatis  1:02:16  
Although I feel 58, obviously longevity is a big part of this. Yeah. When did you start dialing this in as in your health or wellness?

Dave Harvey  1:02:27  
Probably when I met Cassie To be honest, probably 2014 15. Okay. She kind of changed her my views on how food should be seen. I started eating actually pretty healthy from what I thought was healthy, which was from an aesthetic point of view was was kicking goals. Yes. From a gut health and whole food angle. I had a lot to learn. So about four or five years ago, and more recently, probably the last probably when we had Calli so last three years. Mate I'm like a food. I wouldn't say naughty but like, you can always tell people you can always be fitter. If your fit you can be fit if you're strong and be stronger. If you eat well. You can always eat better. Yes is no matter what you do, you can always be better at something there's never too much knowledge and content to learn.

Jac Simmonds  1:03:12  
How would you define how you eat then like what's your what's your nutritional sort of overarching standpoint?

Dave Harvey  1:03:20  
I eat organic, organic food, organic meats. no pesticides, no added hormones, no crap special. Yeah, so get our food from this lovely Asian business in Kellyville. He delivers all our food every Saturday morning, in our boxes. So we just direct deposit in his bank, with a little farm there. And then we get our meats either from Coles or Woolies they've got a little organic section or we get it from doorsteps organics. And that's... we don't do dairy we don't do gluten we get all our others stuff from like bulk whole foods like almond meal and, you know, rice and suffer less than sigma rice and potatoes and I got it because I'm doing CrossFit I'd die.

Nick Papastamatis  1:03:58  
Yes, need the calorie somehow.

Dave Harvey  1:04:00  
Yeah, yeah. So um, but yeah, that's the angle we've taken this angle we eat, no preservatives. So in order to going back to the order of sleep in order of food, if you had a said what would you delete from your food, preservatives, dairy or gluten? I delete preservatives first and I'd have gluten and dairy every single day before it have any preservatives that right? Your body can't break it down like it. Why is there a word on a ingredient packet that you can't pronounce? 100% and why is there a number a number is not a food?

Nick Papastamatis  1:04:30  
I agree with that. I do not live by that.

Dave Harvey  1:04:31  
While I watch him have his cadbury favourite flake.

Jac Simmonds  1:04:37  
Yeah, that's right. Yeah, would you like one? I'm on a numbers diet. Yeah.

Dave Harvey  1:04:45  
That's I just I just think it's logical Health's logical trainings, logical recoveries logical. Yes. eatings. Logical longevity is logical and data learning is it comes down to learning but it's just a lot of people don't know it. And that's the hardest things because what they see on it MSN what they see on there you know newspapers and Instagram you can train and look like this but you can also have this? No shut up whatever you name is nice. You probably can but your blood work is not going to be good your gut health's not gonna be good. your mindset not going to be good. Yeah anxiety and depression levels are not going to be good. Yeah.

Jac Simmonds  1:05:17  
The reality is the way you eat it's not easy. It's it's well it might be for you now but like, which is not convenient it's definitely the right way. There's quicker ways you're gonna be plan.

Dave Harvey  1:05:28  
it's it's not hard. I wouldn't say it's easy. Yeah. I wuldn't say its easy but I wouldn't say it's hard. 

Nick Papastamatis  1:05:33  
Did you go? Did you like go hammer and tongs? Get her all right all the same time? Or did you gradually you

Dave Harvey  1:05:38  
know, I experimented. I did fasting. I did. keto I did. paleo. I did. everything you can think of I actually put weight on fasting , suppose to lose weight, but I put weight on. Yeah. Great for regeneration of cells, by the way. But it's the best and easiest I've done a lot of learning in probably the last 12 months. Right food hygiene and minimal ingredients. Chewing your food. I don't snack anymore. breakfast lunch, dinner only. And then I'll eat after I train. Okay, yeah, and that's all I do better for you gut health so what I try and tell my clients like from a food point of view. If you're obviously like I said before you have your guts healthy your heads healthy. Yeah. But if your think if I made you guys squat every single day, yes, your legs will not recover.

Jac Simmonds  1:05:53  
Definitely.

Dave Harvey  1:06:06  
Yes. Your second session, your third session, your fourth session, your fifth session. It's gonna get worse. Yeah, as the same with your gut when you eat. So if you're having breakfast, morning tea, lunch, afternoon tea dinner, dessert. Your gut is a muscle you know, given you got enough time to recover to break down the nutrients break down the food, you just pile them on top.

Nick Papastamatis  1:06:41  
Especially preservative. Yeah, can't break it down. 100% How is how is your smooth muscle? Now? You said gut is a muscle? Yeah, the smooth muscle going to. And all the filtration and all the cells that are meant to drag out all the nutrients? What nutrients? Yeah. That would be like putting in a slab of clay to try and draw out the nutrients when there aren't any resources. Terrible example, by the way, but yeah,

Dave Harvey  1:07:10  
It works, clay is hard to get out.

Nick Papastamatis  1:07:12  
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Cool. Thank you. Appreciate that.

Jac Simmonds  1:07:14  
Awesome. Some good lessons there.

Nick Papastamatis  1:07:16  
So if you're gonna sort of give some advice to a listener.

Dave Harvey  1:07:24  
Good. Do we have listeners? 

Nick Papastamatis  1:07:29  
Well the point Otherwise, this has been a great conversation. We just had a tea party. Good. What would you say your top five things are on how to be healthy?

Jac Simmonds  1:07:44  
yep. 

Dave Harvey  1:07:45  
Food. Number one. Yeah. understand the importance of food. I wouldn't say the timing for a lot of people say it's timing and a diet and this and stuff like that, etc.

Nick Papastamatis  1:07:55  
Just food in general is one thing to work on with food. 

Dave Harvey  1:07:58  
Whole Foods. Nothing out of a packet.

Nick Papastamatis  1:08:01  
Okay. Try that.

Dave Harvey  1:08:03  
Try it. Don't shop in the middle aisle of Woolies. Okay, simple. That's probably the first time they clean Whole Foods. Know yourself. So know what you respond to in terms of your food and your training. You know, for instance, I work better when I don't eat. And I train. Okay. Okay. Some people work better when they eat and train and learn your learn your little things. You know what works better for you and you fall asleep and whatnot. experimentation. Yeah, yeah, trying. Third thing would probably be trying new things in training and in ending, I guess in in food, it always comes back to food. Sleep well before. And number five. Don't try and win the race. Yeah. Love it in life and in training. But you can play that everything. So a lot of people don't. A lot of people try and win the race in their diet. And a lot of people try to win their race in their training. Like you. You're going to come first today, but you're going to be broken on Thursday. Yeah. Yeah. And I've learned that in the last year and a half my training is like, sweet. I couldn't power clean 70 kilos. Yes. But probably yes. And it was frustrating the hell out of me because I could benchpress 160 Yeah, I was like, Why can I lift this up and squat? Like what's going on? So I slowed it down and got my mindset right. And now, you know, I'm probably pushing my goal was to hit 130 I'm pushing 141 50 Yeah. But that's because doing the little things right to get there and tying everything together

Nick Papastamatis  1:09:37  
because you haven't tried to win the race yet. So yeah, it really sounds like there's there's a love those five because that also captures a lot of just basic lifestyle factors as well like food and sleep. I love the fact that you encouraging experimentation and getting to know yourself and like knowing what works for you. Who cares about why yet? Yeah, it just Is that how you function that that's how you function. Don't worry about the textbook.

Dave Harvey  1:10:05  
So algebra who cares why x equals 24? One of the things that I'm

Nick Papastamatis  1:10:10  
exactly one of the things that I noticed when I when I got the whoop, yep, is exactly number five. Don't try and win the race. I started trying to look like I'm in part of this group. There's no way I'm joining your group is off. And dumb. And literally always like, it made me competitive. Yeah, problem. Hmm. Now I look back on I've got a about two months of data. And I noticed that if I exceed a certain level of strain two days in a row, my recovery plummets. Yeah.

Jac Simmonds  1:10:42  
Yeah. You know, what's

Dave Harvey  1:10:43  
really funny about recovery as well as i've i've had, okay sleeps in the last couple of nights, and my recovery was in really good 93 to 80 ccsa. But a lot the nights before that. Cassie is having a tough time is 37 and a half weeks pregnant. Oh, I'm really tough. Really close. Three, four weeks. And so she went to bed a little bit stress. Now when Cassie stressed I'm stressed, I'm anxious. I had an hour and a half longer sleep on both those nights. Yes. And my recovery was 30% less because of stress. So mindset,

Nick Papastamatis  1:11:14  
right? Yeah. Yeah, cuz cat that happened to cat today. Her recovery 60 something. And she had 100% sleep. All right. Yeah. Well, so it's like, but he didn't train hard yesterday. Yeah. Which is interesting. Full on. So well, Dave. Oh, it's been a pleasure.

Unknown Speaker  1:11:31  
My absolute pleasure.

Jac Simmonds  1:11:32  
Thanks. Thank you,

Nick Papastamatis  1:11:34  
and how can but you've got your own podcast yet.

Dave Harvey  1:11:38  
Soon to be I guess, tweaked around. Yeah. So speaking with David moon was speaking with him and a few other mommies. He's very, very busy man. Yeah, so that that'll come on air probably next couple of weeks. And yeah, that's it and just Yeah, he didn't want anything they split me a message on Instagram me that what's your Instagram Dave Harvey one seven.

Nick Papastamatis  1:11:58  
Dave Harvey17.

Jac Simmonds  1:11:59  
I love it. Well, thanks for coming, man. It's been awesome. Hearing your surgery. professional sport, CrossFit, business. fatherhood, everything. So been a pleasure, man. I love it. Thank you.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai